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Some interesting comments made by the Korean skip after her loss. She said she thought Heather had a good team but that Jenniffer Jones was better and that if they played again she could beat them.

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quote:

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Originally posted by misty1
Some interesting comments made by the Korean skip after her loss. She said she thought Heather had a good team but that Jenniffer Jones was better and that if they played again she could beat them.

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It is harder in Canada for the top teams to get more international experience. They are fighting to just get out of their Province half the time. Many of these world teams are hand picked and then get to curl full time (at Canadian events too). Our Canadian women often don't have that luxury. So kudos to Hyper Heather and her team. And I hope they beat Korea again.

Remember little Miss Korea, curling karma always comes back at you!

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I think the Korean skip was just trying to stir stuff up on curlingzone.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Manitoba Legend
Like many Canadian thirds do in international competition, Beth Iskiw made the wrong sweep call on Heather's attempted raise back and the result was a three for Sweden (great shots by the flame-thrower Pyrtz to do it)

I can't totally blame Iskiw as I've seen other canadian thirds like Kaitlynn Lawes, Cathy O and Jeanna Schraeder goof up badly on the tee. Its a hard job, to be sure!

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Last edited by Nine Ender on 03-21-12 at 03:56PM

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This is getting awful. The united states is battling yeah but theire opponents are also gifitng them alot of shots all of a sudden

Italy wrecked on a guard on a shot for 3 and fell apart

Czech Republic wrecked on a shot for 2

Russia flashed a blank then wrecked on a guard on a chance for 3

They sure do seem to be getting an awful lot of help these days

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quote:

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Originally posted by Manitoba Legend


Yes, Nedohin is riding the thin edge of the wedge but they are winning and thats important (even with tiny margins. Nedohin is a dogged and determined skip who makes a ton of shots, right from basic to semi-high degree of difficulty. She doesn't gas too many - nothing near Kelly Scott, Shannon Kleibrink, Cheryl Bernard levels!)

Iskiw might not be performing at Jeanna Schraeder 'Shredder' levels but she's poised, confident and delivery solid performance after performance. Can the front end hold their end of the bargain?

I think the only threat buried in the morass of 4 loss teams might be the Americans - they could stone some of the current Top4 if they somehow run the table and one of the current 6-2 teams falters and the americans catch a tie-breaker. American third Nicole Jorentstad is evolving into a monster - making high 90s in a couple games as the americans desperatly battle from the sewer.

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Nice to see them prevail against Korea and leading Germany now.

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It's not just a rock. It's forty-two pounds of polished granite, with a beveled underbelly and a handle a human being can hold. Okay, so in and of itself it looks like it has no practical purpose, but it's a repository of possibility. And, when it's handled just right, it exacts a kind of poetry - as close to poetry as I ever want to get. The way it moves.... Not once, in everything I've done, have I ever felt the same wonder and humanity as when I'm playing the game of curling.
Paul Gross-Men With Brooms

Most games are lost, not won!
Casey Stengel

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So i guess Switzerland will be that team that all the four loss teams lookt at to try and get in. I knew denmark would be dangerous for them and now they have to deal with Korea and Russia tommorrow

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After people had written the Americans off, suddenly they win 5 straight and they're a part of the mix. Tough thing is that they need to win both games tomorrow to get in.
Big game tonight for Scotland as they play 6-2 Sweden, lose and you're probably out.

I have to at you guys complaining about Team Canada when they are sitting in 1st place at 7-2. Team Canada is always put down because we expect perfection, when they don't acheive that in our eyes, we put them down.
Results speak for themselves people.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Manitoba Legend
If I'm Heather (which I'm not) I'd be a prayin' tonite that Lady Mirjam holds up and doesn't descend into tie-break country, allowing either or both USA or Scotland back into the fray.

Both Scotland and USA started poorly but one can't even begin to imagine the devestation these two teams could make if they go on a run and are allowed into the playoffs.

USA is starting to burn it up.

And we all know that despite Princess Eve's morose play thus far, she is very capable of taking down anyone in women's curling!!!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Manitoba Legend


Remember the playoff game between Jennifer Jones and Muirhead about 3 years ago (at worlds). JJ thought she had an end locked up (for a steal of 1 or 2) and Muirhead hit her up with a couple of absolutely stunning shots to take a deuce. It was early in the game but Jones was shell-shocked and was very shaky the rest of the game - which Princess easily won!

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Anywhere online to watch the evening draw?

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I'm interested in watching the 'action' unfold between Scotland and Sweden... 6 blank ends... tied 1-1... playing the 8th. Everyone must be playing super defensive in that one.

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Ouch... Eve came up short on her last rock and SWE gets one to win... I said before the game that it would be a slugfest and boy was I wrong... the most defensive game of the week and neither team had anything going. The most rocks in play was in the 10th... Eve nosed a peel with her first... SWE tried draw behind but it stayed out and landed back four, pretty wide open... then EVE came up short on a draw to full four. Can't say this one was a classic.

Korea controlled GER pretty well the whole way and it took till the 8th before GER stopped the defensive style and took some chances... and they actually scored 2. The Korean skipper was very hot and she was too good for GER tonight. KOR had some misses on peels at 3rd but other than that, they are solid.

DEN was making everything and had ITA in trouble every end but somehow ITA made that one saving shot each end to go the entire 10 ends... one of those games that shouldn't have been close but was.

RUS controlled their game but again CZE made enough shots to go 10.

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Can someone explain how the tie-breaker would work for a three-way tie?

Specifically, in this case, if Canada, Korea and Sweden all finish at 9-2. (Since Canada defeated Korea, Korea defeated Sweden, and Sweden beat Canada. It is head-to-head matches that are used as tie-breakers, if I understand correctly...)

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quote:

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Originally posted by Manitoba Legend
The hottest team in the event right now is The American Dreamers - and they can help themselves by rocking Sweden Thursday am.

They still need help but can at least create a tie-break deadlock if the Koreans subdue Miri Ott.

Thats the ticket for the americans to continue pursuit of what many considered a broken dream just a couple days ago.

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It's crunch time folks. Hard to see any of the top three losing any more than 1 game each (not that it cann't happen). Canada has Italy and Scotland, Korea has Switzerland and Russia, Sweden has the U.S.A and Denmark, slightly tougher road for Sweden as Denmark has been up and down and the USA is on a hot roll. As has been already pointed out, The Yanks chances (and Denmarks for that matter) really hinge a lot on how the game between Korea and Switzerland ends up. Switzerland finishes up with Russia. Denmark and the USA finish against each other, might be the game to determine who's in and who's not. It'll be fun!!
Go Team Canada!!

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It's not just a rock. It's forty-two pounds of polished granite, with a beveled underbelly and a handle a human being can hold. Okay, so in and of itself it looks like it has no practical purpose, but it's a repository of possibility. And, when it's handled just right, it exacts a kind of poetry - as close to poetry as I ever want to get. The way it moves.... Not once, in everything I've done, have I ever felt the same wonder and humanity as when I'm playing the game of curling.
Paul Gross-Men With Brooms

Most games are lost, not won!
Casey Stengel

Last edited by celtichound on 03-22-12 at 09:29AM

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In the above described scenario where 3 teams are tied for first after rr....and all have beaten each other, I believe it will go to whatever skill based ranking system they have used....but would involve all players having thrown a rock to the button at some point. In some spiels they "total" all draws for hammer ....in others, all 4 team members throw one rock each in succession after their practice prior to the event getting officially started. Not sure which system they uzse at the Worlds.

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Three teams tied and all have beaten each other then it goes to DSC (draw shot challenge). DSC is the draw to the button for hammer, an average is taken of all the DSC with the worst DSC thrown out (so the 10 best). Team with the best DSC will be placed first.

Google is your friend, spelled out quite clearly in the WCF rules (page 31).

Editted to add - Canada has started with the hammer in 7 of 9 so guessing they have a pretty good DSC.

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Last edited by jhcurl on 03-22-12 at 10:16AM

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Before each game in the round robin, hammer is determined by a draw to the button. They also record all the results and keep them just in case...

...if, at the end of the round robin portion, three or more teams have the same record and head-to-head results cannot determine a ranking, they take the average of all their round robin pre-game draws-to-button (excluding their worst one).

If teams are still tied using this average, the next tie breaker is to compare the two teams' best draw-to-button, then their next best draws-to-button, and so on.

In the utterly astonishing case that two teams both had identical sets of draw-to-button measures, the last tie breaker would be to use their WCF World Rankings.

(I suppose this could happen if two teams managed to cover the pin with all of their round robin draws-to-button, in which case their average would be 0 and each of the draws would also be 0, resulting in a perfect tie all the way along.)

This ranking is used to determine the playoff/tiebreak game match-ups.

Last edited by ngm on 03-22-12 at 10:23AM

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Excellent clarification -- thank you.

quote:

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Originally posted by jhcurl
Google is your friend, spelled out quite clearly in the WCF rules (page 31).

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Agreed. But while The Googles might have led this horse to the water that is a 60-page rule book, I'll drink to your pointing out where specifically to find these details.

quote:

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WCF Rules of Curling C9. (c) (iv)
[T]he Draw Shot Challenge (DSC) [...] is the average distance of the Last Stone Draws (LSD) which were played by a team during the round robin portion of a competition. The single least favourable LSD result is automatically eliminated before calculating this average distance. The team with the lesser DSC receives the higher ranking. If the DSCs are equal, then the team with the best non-equal LSD receives the higher ranking. In case all LSDs are equal, the team ranked higher in the WCF World Rankings is ranked higher.

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Try Googling "best non-equal LSD" (without quotes).

quote:

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Originally posted by ngm
If teams are still tied using this average, the next tie breaker is to compare the two teams' best draw-to-button, then their next best draws-to-button, and so on.

In the utterly astonishing case that two teams both had identical sets of draw-to-button measures, the last tie breaker would be to use their WCF World Rankings.

(I suppose this could happen if two teams managed to cover the pin with all of their round robin draws-to-button, in which case their average would be 0 and each of the draws would also be 0, resulting in a perfect tie all the way along.)

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(And thank you -- 'cuz this "best non-equal" phrase had me seriously puzzled.)

Based on the rules citing measurements of 0.0 cm and 185.4 cm, I'm guessing the precision is to the tenth of a centimeter, and unless there was nothing but 0.0s to compare, the world-rank tie-breaker would never come into play.

Follow up noob questions:

1. They don't happen to make these measurements public do they? (They're not in the stat reports.)

2. Is that same awkward device -- the "micrometer" (thanks Vic!) or competition measure or dial reader or whatever -- is that used to make this last-stone drawn measurement? Or is there another device?

At any rate, I'm hopeful was have three 9-2 teams at the end of this and I get to hear Linda, Vic and Russ having to explain this to a befuddled curling public using these acronyms.

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Looks like Italy (so far) is in a giving mood this morning.

Found this interesting tidbit in the TSN website article:
"Nedohin has a circulatory condition called Raynaud's and she's susceptible to losing feeling in her fingers when she gets cold. The Canadian skip rarely takes off her gloves during a game.
"When we play in bonspiels in the barns, I call them, I freeze," she said. "I have to do a lot of different things to counteract it. I've had it as early as the third or fourth end where I'm losing my sensation."
"I find I lose my sense of draw because I'm a touch player. I have no problems here. It's a warm environment."

__________________
It's not just a rock. It's forty-two pounds of polished granite, with a beveled underbelly and a handle a human being can hold. Okay, so in and of itself it looks like it has no practical purpose, but it's a repository of possibility. And, when it's handled just right, it exacts a kind of poetry - as close to poetry as I ever want to get. The way it moves.... Not once, in everything I've done, have I ever felt the same wonder and humanity as when I'm playing the game of curling.
Paul Gross-Men With Brooms

Most games are lost, not won!
Casey Stengel

Last edited by celtichound on 03-22-12 at 11:50AM

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Team Canada is reminding me of that Molly Hatchet song "Flirtin' With Disaster" today. Better turn it around.

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It's not just a rock. It's forty-two pounds of polished granite, with a beveled underbelly and a handle a human being can hold. Okay, so in and of itself it looks like it has no practical purpose, but it's a repository of possibility. And, when it's handled just right, it exacts a kind of poetry - as close to poetry as I ever want to get. The way it moves.... Not once, in everything I've done, have I ever felt the same wonder and humanity as when I'm playing the game of curling.
Paul Gross-Men With Brooms

Most games are lost, not won!
Casey Stengel

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Look at Italy giving Canada everything they can handle

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If Italy actually held on and won here would this be the country's first every victory over Canada?

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